Fascinating discussion.<br><br>But to all you Adam Smith people, I have to say:<br><br>There is no such thing as the individual small producer: there are factories and workers, monopolies, and wannabe monopolies, and you may think you are free and individual, but we are all workers in a factory, and the bosses are driving down wages and salaries as we speak.<br>
<br>Our real problem is to band together and demand a minimum wage for each category.<br><br>We need a union.<br><br>Of course we have a right to publish our minimum wage! Of course we have a right to declare rates beneath which no-one should be accepting work.<br>
<br>So:<br><br>* All certification under control of the website application developers union (we can affiliate with writers, with communications, etc...) <br>* No to monopoly certification programs and other attempts to create monopolies with the aim of driving down rates.<br>
* Minimum wage for each category.<br>* Drupal free always as in beer and speech. Drupal development open to all.<br><br>Only a uniion can do that.<br><br>Otherwise we'll all be washing dishes in Soho, because it's a better paid job than developing websites.<br>
<br>Consultants, unite! You have nothing to lose except your WSOD.<br><br>Victor Kane<br><a href="http://awebfactory.com.ar">http://awebfactory.com.ar</a><br><a href="http://projectflowandtracker.com">http://projectflowandtracker.com</a><br>
<br><div class="gmail_quote">On Wed, Mar 25, 2009 at 10:28 PM, Michael Prasuhn <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:mike@mikeyp.net">mike@mikeyp.net</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;">
I see the logical fallacy that you present here, but I think that misses the most poignant part of the message you are replying to and that is:<br>
<br>
Publishing your rates != Agreeing to set minimum prices.<br>
<br>
Anyway.<br>
<br>
-Mike<div><div></div><div class="h5"><br>
<br>
<br>
On Mar 25, 2009, at 5:12 PM, Cary Gordon wrote:<br>
<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;">
There is a logical fallacy in there. What you are really claiming is<br>
that rate disclosure does not directly lead to a monopoly, therefor it<br>
is either legal or somehow not as illegal as other collusive behavior.<br>
We could have a long discussion of what type of fallacy it is. I go<br>
for begging the question.<br>
<br>
Feel free to disclose your rates. On advice of counsel, I won't.<br>
<br>
Cary<br>
<br>
On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 1:25 PM, Mehboob Alam <<a href="mailto:malam@thinkx.com" target="_blank">malam@thinkx.com</a>> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;">
But I'm far from convinced that its illegal to share your rates with your competitors,one to one or on a mailing list.<br>
</blockquote>
<br>
If GM, Ford, Chrysler and Toyota agree to set prices, that's "collusion"<br>
<br>
If JetBlue, SouthWest, Alaska and others decide to set minimum prices<br>
for certain routes, that's "collusion"<br>
<br>
If several LCD manufacturers agree to fix their prices, and that ended<br>
up costing Apple a lot of money due to the lack of competitive<br>
bidding, that's "collusion".<br>
<br>
Publishing your rates here.. not so much. The clients have a choice of<br>
thousands of possible vendors for these kinds of projects, and it<br>
would be difficult to set minimum prices.<br>
<br>
And then, anyone who desperately needs the work can easily low-ball<br>
their rates to get the project.<br>
<br>
So, fire away.. :)<br>
<br>
just my opinion..<br>
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</blockquote>
<br>
<br>
<br>
-- <br>
Cary Gordon<br>
The Cherry Hill Company<br>
<a href="http://chillco.com" target="_blank">http://chillco.com</a><br>
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__________________<br><font color="#888888">
Michael Prasuhn<br>
503.488.5433 office<br>
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