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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Stanly I am not sure if you meant this to be blank,
but your message was lost...</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>As for all of you who are interested, I have gone
through almost all of the Documentation Queue, This may mean that some of
the Documentation Items you want have been put as "Fixed". I was very
careful in picking out posts that seemed to have been fixed through revisions or
other means. I worked with fellow members of the Doc Team to assure that
the least amount of problems could of occurred, but with over 400 document
issues that I reviewed, I may have made a mistake. So please go to Drupal
and check your issues, to make sure no mistakes where made. And please
activate any Item you think needs attention. I will work hard in the next
few weeks to get as much done to prepare for this and other changes to
come. In case a mistake was made, your issue will be moved up in the
Queue, so its kind of a good thing!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>As for this topic, I have opened up a ticket
</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><A
href="http://drupal.org/node/446744">http://drupal.org/node/446744</A></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>There is a large number of related items to this
area of the documentation (more then anywhere else). I am going to focus
on improving this area as much as I can where and when I'm needed, but as always
we need your help, input, feedback and even WILD IDEAS! I think we need to
move out of the box on this one!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Mike</FONT></DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt Tahoma">
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="BACKGROUND: #f5f5f5">
<DIV style="font-color: black"><B>From:</B> <A
title="mailto:sstanly88@yahoo.com CTRL + Click to follow link"
href="mailto:sstanly88@yahoo.com">Stanly Smith</A> </DIV>
<DIV><B>Sent:</B> Friday, May 01, 2009 9:46 AM</DIV>
<DIV><B>To:</B> <A
title="mailto:documentation@drupal.org CTRL + Click to follow link"
href="mailto:documentation@drupal.org">A list for documentation writers</A>
</DIV>
<DIV><B>Subject:</B> Re: [documentation] Proposal of HandBook and
CVSdocumentationchanges!</DIV></DIV></DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
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<TD vAlign=top><BR><BR>--- On <B>Mon, 4/27/09, Mike Parisi <I><<A
title="mailto:mgparisi@rochester.rr.com CTRL + Click to follow link"
href="mailto:mgparisi@rochester.rr.com">mgparisi@rochester.rr.com</A>></I></B>
wrote:<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: rgb(16,16,255) 2px solid"><BR>From:
Mike Parisi <<A
href="mailto:mgparisi@rochester.rr.com">mgparisi@rochester.rr.com</A>><BR>Subject:
Re: [documentation] Proposal of HandBook and CVS
documentationchanges!<BR>To: "A list for documentation writers" <<A
href="mailto:documentation@drupal.org">documentation@drupal.org</A>><BR>Date:
Monday, April 27, 2009, 10:02 PM<BR><BR>
<DIV id=yiv1356456132>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt Tahoma"><FONT face=Arial>Going through these
documents, I can find allot of "out of scope" information. I think
we can trim out this information to make these documents shorter.
People don’t want to read long documents, and do not. Please see
<A
title="http://drupal.org/node/446654#comment-1526984 CTRL + Click to follow link"
href="http://drupal.org/node/446654#comment-1526984" target=_blank
rel=nofollow>http://drupal.org/node/446654#comment-1526984</A> for
an example of were I think this is pushing the limits of what is in
scope. In fact allot of this information has nothing to do with
CVS access at all!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt Tahoma"><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt Tahoma"><FONT face=Arial>This document maybe
moved, but it wont ever be deleted. It needs allot of attention
and the hand of a true writer.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>It is clear that there is some frustration
over the application process for CVS access. That people are not
reading it all. Yet bloating the document makes things worse, not
better. We need the best of the best of the Doc Team to come in
and re-do this. A good writer will say more in less words. I
tend to try and write more to cover all aspects of a topic. Thus I
tend to bloat a document to include things that maybe obvious to
others.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>In the end, the person maintaining CVS
access will always get bad CVS requests. I feel this is a crucial
area of Drupal that requires a person who has a very patient
attitude. Getting people to Contrib. is probably one of the most
important aspects of the website and community. I will ask that I
am not apart of the people who review's these requests because I know I
have the patience of a (thinking of some analogy)... Spitting
Cobra! A-HA!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Mike</FONT></DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt Tahoma"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="BACKGROUND: #f5f5f5; FONT: 10pt Tahoma">
<DIV><B>From:</B> <A title=drupal@rocktreesky.com
href="http://us.mc01g.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=drupal@rocktreesky.com"
target=_blank rel=nofollow
ymailto="mailto:drupal@rocktreesky.com">Addison Berry</A> </DIV>
<DIV><B>Sent:</B> Monday, April 27, 2009 5:07 PM</DIV>
<DIV><B>To:</B> <A title=documentation@drupal.org
href="http://us.mc01g.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=documentation@drupal.org"
target=_blank rel=nofollow ymailto="mailto:documentation@drupal.org">A
list for documentation writers</A> </DIV>
<DIV><B>Subject:</B> Re: [documentation] Proposal of HandBook and CVS
documentationchanges!</DIV></DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>Yeah, this stuff has been in need of a "do-over" for a
while generally. I will say though that these *were* more consolidated
when the Getting Involved book was created. I have reverted the moves
that have happened since then to re-consolidate them, for the
time-being. That is, I have moved Drupal and CVS back to the Getting
Involved guide, and I moved the Start/Maintain a Module back under the
Contribute Code section. We definitely have some large
architectural issues in the handbook and we also do not have any clear
way to "control" it, even if we set it, since different people see
things being organized in different ways and we have no restrictions on
book organizational changes at the moment.
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>I would ask that folks hold off making big location changes in the
documentation for the time-being, unless it is discussed on the list or
in an issue in the doc queue first, with broad consensus that
it "just makes sense." The reason for this is that I will be making a
really big announcement in the next two weeks about the overall docs
roadmap and one of the biggest pieces of that will be the IA
(information architecture) of all Drupal docs. We have an IA person who
has volunteered to lead the project (and everyone will be encouraged to
be a part of it). Once we get some preliminary stuff taken care of and I
can articulate all of this stuff in a meaningful way about how we can
move forward, I'll be posting to the doc list and then making a front
page post on Drupal.org.</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>Mike, thanks for bringing this up, as it is very important and
something we need to really figure out a long-term solution for, so I
hope you will keep digging in to this and giving us feedback.</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>Thanks all :-)</DIV>
<DIV>Addi</DIV>
<DIV><BR>
<DIV>
<DIV>On Apr 27, 2009, at 4:38 PM, Mike Parisi wrote:</DIV><BR
class=Apple-interchange-newline>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV id=MailContainerBody
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 10px; PADDING-LEFT: 10px; PADDING-TOP: 15px">
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I know this post wont be perfect, and I
don’t mean to insult anyone. If I do its completely
unintentional and due to a statement that was probably a bit
skewed.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I have been beating my head over CVS for
MONTHS. Partially because the documentation is scattered and not
organized. Often times you read a document and it mentions allot
of specifics (But not all) about CVS. What you need is
missing, for example a major document on CVS contribute does not
contain other CVS utilities, while these are located in another
section of the site. This leaves the reader feeling empty and
also leaves us not looking elsewhere. This also bloats pages so
that users feel daunted by the tasks required.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I propose a major change in the structure
of these sections for many reasons. The most prominent one is
that the information is scattered across 3 separate
area's!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><A href="http://drupal.org/node/10259"
target=_blank rel=nofollow>http://drupal.org/node/10259</A><BR><A
href="http://drupal.org/node/7765" target=_blank
rel=nofollow>http://drupal.org/node/7765</A><BR><A
href="http://drupal.org/handbook/cvs" target=_blank
rel=nofollow>http://drupal.org/handbook/cvs</A> </FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I think that many of these pages are
bloated duplicate information and thus are not read! This is
evident in the <A
title="http://drupal.org/cvs-application/requirements CTRL + Click to follow link"
href="http://drupal.org/cvs-application/requirements" target=_blank
rel=nofollow>http://drupal.org/cvs-application/requirements</A>
contains the following statement: </FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>"If you just scrolled down this page to
the apply link and didn't read the page, don't expect to get a CVS
account. It seems many people are doing just that and submitting poor
motivation messages resulting in a high decline rate."</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Well this is probably because people can
not find the information they need, and the page contains everything
from CVS information to Coding Standards information. I will fix
a few problems I have found with the current structure, but this is
very complex set of documentation with allot of overlapping
information and unclear navigation.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>One proposal is that much of the
information should (or is) included in the <A
href="http://drupal.org/handbook/cvs" target=_blank
rel=nofollow>http://drupal.org/handbook/cvs</A>, and removed from the
handbook. Instead a sub page in the handbook that specifically
talks about CVS and Coding Standards should be added to the
handbook. That adds a quick over-view of why CVS and Coding
Standards and where to find the information needed. It is
important </FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Finding the documents is confounded
because Druplicons "cvs?" command is unclear at best and does not
include all three links above.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV></DIV>--<BR>Pending
work: <A href="http://drupal.org/project/issues/documentation/"
target=_blank
rel=nofollow>http://drupal.org/project/issues/documentation/</A><BR>List
archives: <A href="http://lists.drupal.org/pipermail/documentation/"
target=_blank
rel=nofollow>http://lists.drupal.org/pipermail/documentation/</A></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>THANKS FROM STANLEY</DIV></DIV>-----<BR><BR>
<DIV class=plainMail>--<BR><A
href="http://lists.drupal.org/pipermail/documentation/"
target=_blank>/</A></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR>
<P>
<HR>
<P></P>--<BR>Pending work:
http://drupal.org/project/issues/documentation/<BR>List archives:
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