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<DIV dir=ltr><FONT face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>You included in your email
message hyperbole. You made characterizations with leading questions that
merely serve to inflame and exacerbate the situation then contribute towards a
solution. I, as part of the community working towards improving it, felt
attacked by your forwarded message.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr><FONT face=Arial size=2>
<DIV dir=ltr><FONT face=Arial size=2>I don't understand why you make ME feel bad
with the leading phrases in your complaints. <FONT face=Arial
size=2>You started the conversation with the phrasing that you were
being insulted. You are not being insulted. You never
were. You still aren't.</FONT></FONT></DIV></FONT></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr><FONT face=Arial size=2>
<DIV dir=ltr><FONT face=Arial size=2>Again, you are reading into the
message that which is not there. I took the time to answer and explain
that no one is getting in your way. That people are working towards better
solutions and that at least one of those answers was in the
email </FONT><FONT face=Arial size=2>you forwarded. I explained
part of how the current system works.</FONT></DIV></FONT></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr><FONT face=Arial size=2>You characterize the 'system' as insulting
or rude. A large part of the 'system' as you put it is people. A
large part of the 'process' is manual. There is no
autonomous 'system' that sits in a vacuum and does 'things'. People
are working to make it better. Perhaps you could have replied back to
Gerhard and asked what you could do to help.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr><FONT face=Arial size=2>As to what to do in your situation? I
would have replied back and asked what was the next step. Your original
question appeared to have been answered. Again, as indicated in the
original message, Gerhard is working on a solution to automate this. Until
recently, it wasn't possible.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr><FONT face=Arial size=2>And finally once again, no one is insulting
you. No one is ridiculing you. Gerhard did not. I did
not. Again, you are portraying yourself as the victim when you are
not.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr><FONT face=Arial size=2>I understand where you are coming
from. Perhaps (other than automating the process which you have already
been informed is being worked on) you could suggest specific improvements
and wording to the documentation to help others avoid the
experiance.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr><FONT face=Arial size=2>Your phrasing was perhaps not the best way
to introduce discussion about the issue you have experienced and how to work
towards a process that helps improve that experiance for others. I would
suggest you start with Gerhard as he is one of those working on improving the
process. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr><FONT face=Arial size=2>-sp</FONT></DIV></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr><BR>
<HR tabIndex=-1>
<FONT face=Tahoma size=2><B>From:</B> support-bounces@drupal.org on behalf of
Isaac Horton<BR><B>Sent:</B> Sun 1/15/2006 1:29 PM<BR><B>To:</B>
support@drupal.org<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: [support] Re: CVS account and need for
a drupal desigchampion....<BR></FONT><BR></DIV>
<DIV>i never said anyone (a person) is getting in my way.<BR>im merely telling
you all because im about to bail out... without giving my contributions to the
community.<BR>its not my intention. just the system appears to be set up that
way...<BR>I never said any person has been rude to me.. on the
contrary...<BR>but the system is rude to me... isnt that fair to say?<BR>I see
people requesting for more and better themes and when i try to
volunteer/contribute. im not able easily..<BR>the reason i forwarded this
message to support is because this is a big enough issue for me to stop
contributing.<BR>im working right now with Kieran Lal to try to redesign the
flow of the admin interface for the drupal community.<BR>im not griping a
diatribe! this is valid and you should really do your best to see where im
coming from .<BR>labeling me as someone who is using buzz words to get attention
does nothing to address the issues im raising.<BR>in fact your attitude is
anything but understanding of my situation...<BR><BR>My question to the drupal
community is what do you do when someone like me has a problem?<BR>You said in
your email steven that drupal is in need of volunteers..<BR>hello... thats what
im trying to do... and i cant.... <BR>is that not needed to be said?<BR><BR>i
dont understand why you make me feel bad when all im trying to do is let you all
know whats happening to me so WE can keep it from happening to other
people....<BR>read my email again if youre confused... im not blaming any
person... but i am stating the truth of my experience... you can accept it or
not... but its my truth regardless...<BR>and the fact is im a good designer too,
and it might even benefit to help me out a little to get on board....
<BR><BR>right now im feeling attacked by your letter<BR>oh well im still writing
because i care about the WHOLE and i want others to be able to contribute easily
too...<BR>whats wrong with wanting all of that.<BR>and why am i being ridiculed
for giving feedback?<BR>how do you expect to make the system better....<BR>where
am i supposed to put this message?<BR>these are all unanswered questions by
me...<BR><BR><BR><BR>Steven Peck wrote:
<BLOCKQUOTE cite="" type="cite">
<DIV id=idOWAReplyText99841 dir=ltr>
<DIV dir=ltr><FONT face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>No, actually, it did not
need to be said. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr><FONT face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>Gerhard said in his
message that he was writing a module to do this. We suffer from a
terminal lack of volunteers willing to do work of any type. So some
things get more attention when those willing and able have the time to do
so. Only in December did the complete infrastructure of Drupal.org
finally get moved. This infrastructure change itself is what has made it
possible to even have this happen and took a few people a lot of man hours
of work to accomplish.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr><FONT face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>These things take
time. They take human beings real hours and real days to do.
No one is trying to 'insult' you and I had to count to 10 a few times at your
presumption that anyone was before I composed this message.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr><FONT face=Arial size=2>To be clear: NO ONE IS DELIBERATELY
GETTING IN YOUR WAY!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr><FONT face=Arial size=2>Using buzz word compliant terms like
'win/win' without offers to work/work/collaborate doesn't help.
Especially when nowhere in that polite message back to you did anyone tell you
to go <FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3>&^%$ yourself. Using such
inflammatory phrasing is an Internet troll trick to create a problem or
pick a fight while portraying yourself as the victim.</FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr>Gerhard informed you in his polite message that he was
working on this so obviously he cares, yet you launched into your diatribe
anyway.</DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr><FONT face=Arial size=2>-sp</FONT></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr> </DIV></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr><BR>
<HR tabIndex=-1>
<FONT face=Tahoma size=2><B>From:</B> <A class=moz-txt-link-abbreviated
href="mailto:support-bounces@drupal.org">support-bounces@drupal.org</A> on
behalf of Isaac Horton<BR><B>Sent:</B> Sun 1/15/2006 11:18 AM<BR><B>To:</B>
Gerhard Killesreiter; <A class=moz-txt-link-abbreviated
href="mailto:support@drupal.org">support@drupal.org</A><BR><B>Subject:</B>
[support] Re: CVS account and need for a drupal design
champion....<BR></FONT><BR></DIV>
<DIV>This is exactly the kind of response that leaves me wondering.....<BR>im
just trying to get into the contributions.<BR>i can login via eclipse
anonymously no problem.<BR>this raises a much bigger issue.<BR>.<BR>It works
like this for me.. ive got x % of time to donate to the "drupal cause".<BR>so
far for me 60% of x has been spent in frustration due to no cvs access, poor
themeing structure and loose organizational support of design in the drupal
community?<BR>how much can I endure, before ive become worn and jaded to whats
really possible here?? (how many before me have just walked away after
confronting such difficulty?)<BR>i feel like the type of contributions someone
like me (a designer) can make is <U>drastically </U>limited because of the
extra hoops I have to jump through. just to contribute..aka(volunteer)? im
growing weary of trying so hard... <BR>Its insulting and further incentive to
use other tools that manifest a more win/win (timesaving)approach vs. the
standard drupal approach that ive observed...."make it really hard, really
really hard to contribute.... and if youre a designer.... well just go
&^%$ yourself... and go away" (or be prepared to donate a vast amount of
time to do something that other orgs have automated and appear to care more
about.<BR><BR>i like drupal. i want to help...<BR>but i can only "tread
water"(keep it up) for so long while the system thats currently in place
serves to suppress my motivation.<BR>Isnt there anyone in the Drupal Core team
who "champions" the need for good design?<BR>will this ever be
addressed?<BR>Does anyone even care?<BR>sorry for the gurmbles! but this needs
to be said.......<BR><BR><BR>-Isaac<BR><BR><BR><BR>Gerhard Killesreiter wrote:
<BLOCKQUOTE cite="" type="cite">Isaac Horton wrote: <BR><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">Im just wondering what every happened to my cvs
account request. supposedly i was added but when i try to login, i can
only do it anonymously. <BR>ive tried a million combination of my
passcodes and now its been quite a few months and i still cant offer up
the contributions Ive created? <BR>I dont want to be a pain in the ass but
is there any way you can reset my cvs account password?????
<BR><BR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>First of all: Which repository are you trying to
access? Second: no, I can't reset the password, but I am writing a Drupal
module that will allow you to do that after it is insallted on drupal.org.
<BR><BR>Cheers, <BR> Gerhard
<BR><BR><BR><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV>
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