Re: [development] 5.0 Core Theme Update
I think a happy medium (since this is a theme by committee) is a "Powered by Drupal" button/icon/something above the fold. This would probably be something most people will want to leave in place to show their support for Drupal. And not hinder them putting content in other places. The first thing people do with Bluemarine, I'm guessing, is to strip (somewhat difficultly for newbies) the Drupal logo at the top. If there is a "powered by" button, above the fold, and NOT the big giant Drupal logo, then people are going to be more likely to leave it in place even when they customize the theme. Someone with a better grasp of the english language can probably help me explain what I'm trying to say. :) [I know redneck(though I am NOT one), as I wuz born in Georgia!] Trae On 9/25/06, Richard Archer <drupal.org@juggernaut.com.au> wrote:
At 6:34 PM +0200 25/9/06, Gerhard Killesreiter wrote:
I think that is okay to not have as a hard requirement. I think a better statement on branding would be "It should look recognizable as Drupal, once deployed on a bunch of new sites, for the sorts of people who notice such things."
Sorry, but I disagree. Branding needs to be more obvious.
I agree. As this is the default theme for new installs, the DrupalIcon and drupal brand should be very prominent in the header. The user can then tweak this branding to suit their requirements.
There could also be a "Powered by Drupal" icon in the footer which the user may choose to leave alone, even after replacing the Drupal branding in the header.
...R.
-- Trae McCombs || http://occy.net/ Founder - Themes.org // Linux.com
Trae McCombs wrote:
I think a happy medium (since this is a theme by committee) is a "Powered by Drupal" button/icon/something above the fold. This would probably be something most people will want to leave in place to show their support for Drupal. And not hinder them putting content in other places. The first thing people do with Bluemarine, I'm guessing, is to strip (somewhat difficultly for newbies) the Drupal logo at the top.
I am totally ok with them removing the Druplicon after the install. In fact I used to complain if somebody didn't replace the favicon with one of his own. The point it to show branding to the guy who installs the CMS. It is also not difficult to replace the logo, you only need to upload a new one.
If there is a "powered by" button, above the fold, and NOT the big giant Drupal logo, then people are going to be more likely to leave it in place even when they customize the theme.
I won't mind a html block which has such a banner. Cheers, Gerhard
On Sep 25, 2006, at 4:14 PM, Gerhard Killesreiter wrote:
It is also not difficult to replace the logo, you only need to upload a new one.
I have been doing some user testing on logo changing, this week, and in fact it's quite difficult for new users. It is a serious user experience issue because many people report that they want to immediately change the look of their site so they feel they own it. New users have to go to administer >> themes >> global settings, which they have to figure out as there is no instructions in the interface. You are then presented with four area's of configuration options: Toggle Display, Display post information on, Logo image settings, and Shortcut icon settings. In total there are 234 words to read and understand on this page in 4.7, I yet haven't checked how many words in 5.0. This tells us the cognitive load for understanding this page is quite high. There are three options within the logo image settings. Default, custom path, and upload. It seems like you should really only have two options, use the default Drupal icon, or use a different one. Here is what I am observing: 1) Task completion on changing logo's is poor. 2) Error rates in discovering how to change a logo is high. Even if you knew exactly where to go it's a minimum of 4 clicks for a initial task, with plenty of room to make mistakes. 3) Time is not unreasonable, but it could be much faster in the cases where they succeed. 4) Users failure to complete the change in the look of their site leaves them with a subjective negative experience. Here is the actual quote from someone with top ranked Computer Science degree, who is software professional just a few hours ago. "I can't find the place where I can add a graphic to the top. I lost it somewhere..." Concrete suggestions: 1) It seems to me that custom path and upload fields could be merged into one. This is currently done with the TinyMCE and IMCE modules if someone is looking for an example. 2) We need to come up with a fast, error free way, to change that logo and make the user have a positive experience in controlling the look and feel of their site. Suggestions: tooltips with instructions on how to change, instructions embedded in the image, welcome page instructions to be tested with newer users. 3) If we do create an initial configuration process then modifying the logo should be part of that process. This is part of a general problem of Drupal's administration interface being feature oriented (logo is part of the theme features and is therefore in administer >> themes >> global settings) instead of situationally aware that changing the logo is a common initial task that is part of initial site configuration. Perhaps more situational interfaces could be introduced as a goal in the future. Cheers, Kieran
Kieran Lal wrote:
3) If we do create an initial configuration process then modifying the logo should be part of that process. This is part of a general problem of Drupal's administration interface being feature oriented (logo is part of the theme features and is therefore in administer >> themes >> global settings) instead of situationally aware that changing the logo is a common initial task that is part of initial site configuration. Perhaps more situational interfaces could be introduced as a goal in the future. It's a general problem with many feature-oriented interfaces.
Some obvious questions: Are there other common look-and-feel tasks that occur at this point in the user's experience? Any feel as to whether changing the (default) theme should be done before or after changing the logo? Are there any other tasks, besides configuring look-and-feel, that compete for the user's attention immediately after setup and logging in as administrator? Gary
+1 on what Kieran said... Please read below for a super cool idea on how to fix this problem. On 9/26/06, Kieran Lal <kieran@civicspacelabs.org> wrote:
2) We need to come up with a fast, error free way, to change that logo and make the user have a positive experience in controlling the look and feel of their site. Suggestions: tooltips with instructions on how to change, instructions embedded in the image, welcome page instructions to be tested with newer users.
Hmmm, I just had an interesting idea... I'll get flamed for it I'm sure as I have no way to implement it, or even if it's possible. But what seems like it would be cool is, to provide a "Lock/Unlock" Theme switch that an admin could even hide. So somewhere, on the default theme, Perhaps above the Login area, or somewhere on the actual Primary Links, you have something like: Theme Details: Change / Hide This [?] Perhaps we use AJAX goodness, and if you click the "Change" button, then the logo, mission statement, other items right there on the front page immediately become editable via some form or some thing. Next to the Drupal Logo would now be the words: "Click to change this image". with AJAX browse for new logo and upload all rolled into one easy thingy. If they click the [?] it tells them what that stuff is all for. If they click Hide, it prompts "Are you sure you want to hide this, it will make it more difficult for you to change your theme elements in the future?" Am I a genius or what? *chuckle* Peace Love and Bananas. Trae 3) If we do create an initial configuration process then modifying the logo
should be part of that process. This is part of a general problem of Drupal's administration interface being feature oriented (logo is part of the theme features and is therefore in administer >> themes >> global settings) instead of situationally aware that changing the logo is a common initial task that is part of initial site configuration. Perhaps more situational interfaces could be introduced as a goal in the future.
Cheers, Kieran
-- Trae McCombs || http://occy.net/ Founder - Themes.org // Linux.com
On Sep 26, 2006, at 6:35 AM, Trae McCombs wrote:
Perhaps we use AJAX goodness, and if you click the "Change" button, then the logo, mission statement, other items right there on the front page immediately become editable via some form or some thing.
http://cvs.drupal.org/viewcvs/drupal/contributions/sandbox/timcn/soc/ liveedit/ http://groups.drupal.org/soc-admin-usability-improvements http://drupal.org/node/78942 http://drupal.org/user/14572 enjoy, -dww
On 26 Sep 2006, at 10:36, Kieran Lal wrote:
It is also not difficult to replace the logo, you only need to upload a new one.
I have been doing some user testing on logo changing, this week, and in fact it's quite difficult for new users. It is a serious user experience issue because many people report that they want to immediately change the look of their site so they feel they own it.
I agree. Task completion on changing logos is poor. I've had quite a few complaints about the logo being hard to change. For starters, it requires that the user has the files-directory properly setup and that he can figure out the location and UI for uploading a new logo. Then, often times, the logo is too small or too big. The entire process can easily take up 20 minutes and is not free of frustrations. Not exactly fun if this is part of your first 30 minutes of Drupal.
1) Task completion on changing logo's is poor. 2) Error rates in discovering how to change a logo is high. Even if you knew exactly where to go it's a minimum of 4 clicks for a initial task, with plenty of room to make mistakes. 3) Time is not unreasonable, but it could be much faster in the cases where they succeed. 4) Users failure to complete the change in the look of their site leaves them with a subjective negative experience.
-- Dries Buytaert :: http://www.buytaert.net/
participants (6)
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Derek Wright -
Dries Buytaert -
Gary Feldman -
Gerhard Killesreiter -
Kieran Lal -
Trae McCombs