NK wrote: "Lisa tried to provoke a flame war. Succeeded. Of course the developers and I am sure Gerhard too cares about the community -- why do you think he answers the forums, shepherds the translators and manages CVS accounts besides coding?" Sorry. It was not my intention to flame and I hadn't even thought of this discussion as a flame war (well, except for the highly inflammatory nature of Liza's post). It seems quite civil :) And I might be wrong, but as direct as Gerhard likes to be, I suspect he didn't take my response personally. But I do believe that more community focus, more end user focus, would benefit everyone in the long term. The payoff's not immediately apparent up front, but one must invest in the future. This, I believe, is the crux of Liza's complaint, and it's a perception of balance. More short term reward with less emphasis on long term marketing benefits vs. weighing promotion through more sensitiviy of end user needs as the means to long term prosperity. So the everyone does their own thing, "that's it," is not the mantra I would choose for Drupal. Maybe I'm wrong, but I happen to believe in the collaborative process and facilitating it as the best means to the end, and that process depends on everyone. For instance, I would suspect that if Drupal made a major push to focus on a mini-usability release for 4.8 with significantly improved documentation (no long waits for newer features), that the pay off in the next few years would be incredible.