[development] websiteoptimization.com css size

Bèr Kessels ber at webschuur.com
Sat Jan 7 08:52:19 UTC 2006

Oh, oh, Stupid me. 

I think I need to explain a little and apologise. 
My original post about the patches not making it in, and so ended with /end 

I worded it terribly, now that i reread it a couple of times. for I meant this 
as a jokish reply to stop this thread from starting in the first place. 

The discussion about what Drupal.css should be, will be, about what patches do 
and what don't and so on was held a lot of of times. Yet *that* specific 
thing is not solved, and will not get solved, as far as I can see. I wrote 
about that in the post below. 
I tried to explain it in that mail below. I rewrote that mail five times, so 
not to make that same mistake again. Unfortunately It did fire up that 
thread :( The contrary from what I tried to achieve with the mail.

My apologies if I sound like a whining kid who starts yelling as soon as he 
does not get what he wants. I did not intend my original post like that. I 
intended it as
 "Let us not start talking about that css again, nothing has been decided so 
far, efforts to get that css skinned, spring-cleaned etc. have died in heated 
debates ".

So I hope that, if we want to revive this discussion, we can do so, together 
with some real action. Action, that, this time is backed up by (core) 
developers willing to help (as pointed out, that is the case). And by a 
consensus about drupal.css' task (which, I see as a problem still).

Removing four small chunks will not really get us anywhere. Removing 400 lines 
neither.  But, as Dries points out, removing hundred times four small chunks 
will get us there. 

Again, my apologies for the misplaced, and misworded joke :)


Op vrijdag 06 januari 2006 19:13, schreef Bèr Kessels:
> Op vrijdag 06 januari 2006 08:46, schreef Dries Buytaert:
> > Ber is wrong, Neil is right.  Patches do get through, just don't try
> > to do it in one go.  Stop whining about it, and start contributing
> > patches. :)
> Sorry, I will not stop whining about this. People have written a lot of
> patches for this, most of the writers are considered themers. All of these
> patches are either still open, or were, in the end committed as a
> one-or-two line fix, instead of the proposed "lets strip all the foo, bar
> and more" patches.
> The reason is not that Dries nor anyone else is not willing to commit the
> patches. Let that be clear. The reason is that everytime the time that same
> stupid debate comes up: Should drupal.css be there for a nice,
> out-of-the-box working site, or should it only provide the highly nessecary
> lines. We never came to any agreement there, and I think we will never come
> to that.
> That was wat I was referring to. not to the patches per se, but to changes
> some patches want to make. Those changes, don't get through. Or if they
> did, they only fixed small thingies, they removed, for example, a no longer
> used line. But netto, the drupal.css file grew with 82 lines (13%) between
> 4.6 and now. Not exactly the thing most patches, themers and issues wanted
> to achieve. I still count 35 colors, 52 margins 37 paddings, 14 floats
> etcetc.
> And yes, removing them, will render a lot of pieces of drupal less
> friendly, ugly or even unsuable. So removing them will make the
> out-of-the-box-experience bad. But a theme like CS, will fix this
> experience. And It will definately make a lot of themers happy.
> I will be the first to spend my weekends on completely skinning that
> drupal.css. (in fact, i have a recent patch here, my drupal.css only 120
> lines) But for now I stopped committing those (and started pointing people
> at the fact that this ever recurring issue is ever recurring), because it
> would be rejected in a discussion anyway.
> Bèr

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