thanks everyone for the comments. Nick had an interesting comment I'm forwarding. It's great that Gordon has volunteered to help with what Dries said. (I don't know enough to help.) Re Robert's comment that there are obscure but great modules, it makes sense to me that there should be a way to rename modules (or at least link new names to modules), and a page to submit new name suggestions. If it does not take too much time, I may be able to volunteer to monitor such a page, and change the names of modules, or something. ae On Tue, 2006-01-24 at 21:42 -0600, Nick Lewis wrote:
I moved this to infastructure [it seemed like the right place]... I think something like this would really be helpful to new and old users alike. In order to gauge a module's stability, I have to sort through filters of messages, and CVS histories. Most people think CVS is a place to fill prescriptions.
Of course, the number of downloads would only be a useful measure (in my opinion) with the following additional measures(stolen from downloads.com to some extent):
a) a non-anonymous rating system that requires a drupal.org user account. Ratings include: 1=doesn't work at all, 2=frequently crashes site 3=kind of buggy 4=reliable, with minor bugs 5=recommended
b) number of downloads -- by total, by month, and by week
c)open comments on module front page.
It is fairly time consuming to research a module -- to tell you the truth, I usually just test out the module on a live site. And while bug reports work well for experienced users, and/or users with time, a more instant way to give feedback would be nice. I'd love to see a module's front page have a comment at the top of the page that says "This module rocks!", or "this module broke my site".
All together, expanding the ways that users can give feedback on modules would be a great improvement to drupal.org. It would both help good modules gain attention, and use, while singling out certain modules that fail to work Installing modules is too much like gambling... Seasoned users have learned to live with it; however, new users may very well judge drupal badly as a whole when they use a module that doesn't work.
Few cents of a recently devalued currency, Nick Lewis http://nicklewis.smartcampaigns.com
c)open comments on module front page.
A simpler (?) solution would be to have a forum for each module. I always forget that the link to "Support Forum" is not module specific. I can't count the times I've click that link only to be disappointed by the lack of specificity. Cheers -Mark
+5. I'd say rename the link, but the name is accurate. It is my expectation that is innacurate, but I'd be willing to bet most people who are new to Drupal and drupal.org make the same innacurate assumption. On 1/25/06, Mark Fredrickson <mfredrickson@ppmns.org> wrote:
c)open comments on module front page.
A simpler (?) solution would be to have a forum for each module. I always forget that the link to "Support Forum" is not module specific. I can't count the times I've click that link only to be disappointed by the lack of specificity.
Cheers -Mark
-- Proud member of the KEXP cubicle army. http://www.cubiclearmy.com
On Jan 25, 2006, at 9:57 AM, Mark Fredrickson wrote:
c)open comments on module front page.
A simpler (?) solution would be to have a forum for each module. I always forget that the link to "Support Forum" is not module specific. I can't count the times I've click that link only to be disappointed by the lack of specificity.
Code is here: http://cvs.drupal.org/viewcvs/drupal/contributions/ modules/project/ File a patch here: http://drupal.org/node/add/project_issue/Project The project module has gotten a bad rep due to neglect. CSL, Nedjo, and Dries have put a lot of work into improving it. It's time to stop calling for complete re-writes of the Project module and for the community to start feeling comfortable submitting patches to the most important module in Drupal. Thanks, Kieran
Cheers -Mark
The project module has gotten a bad rep due to neglect. CSL, Nedjo, and Dries have put a lot of work into improving it. It's time to stop calling for complete re-writes of the Project module and for the community to start feeling comfortable submitting patches to the most important module in Drupal.
Well said! :) -- Dries Buytaert :: http://www.buytaert.net/
Kieran: On 26-Jan-06, at 11:09 AM, Kieran Lal wrote:
A simpler (?) solution would be to have a forum for each module. I always forget that the link to "Support Forum" is not module specific. I can't count the times I've click that link only to be disappointed by the lack of specificity.
Code is here: http://cvs.drupal.org/viewcvs/drupal/contributions/ modules/project/
File a patch here: http://drupal.org/node/add/project_issue/Project
The project module has gotten a bad rep due to neglect. CSL, Nedjo, and Dries have put a lot of work into improving it. It's time to stop calling for complete re-writes of the Project module and for the community to start feeling comfortable submitting patches to the most important module in Drupal.
We all agree that project module is a core piece of functionality for our community. I have taken several runs at using it as a user, since the 4.4 days. Whether through neglect or it being fundamentally bad (chicken and egg...if it's bad, it doesn't get fixed), base functionality hasn't worked out of the box outside of Drupal.org. People that have been around that long have all felt the pain, and are skeptical about the current codebase. So...just wanted to clear the air about that. The very fact that project runs only with HEAD is part of this issue. Again, AFAIK, current 4.6 download is broken by default. We should remove old releases unless they are going to be fixed... I *don't* think it's time to stop calling for complete re-writes of Project...the in between reality is that we need to work with what we have now and for the foreseeable future until we have the time/money/ resources to do a planned rewrite that forms a good basis for further improvements/extensions...kind of like all of Drupal. So for now...put down your project.module pitchforks, and file/review patches. -- Boris Mann Vancouver 778-896-2747 San Francisco 415-367-3595 SKYPE borismann http://www.bryght.com
The project module has gotten a bad rep due to neglect. CSL, Nedjo, and Dries have put a lot of work into improving it. It's time to stop calling for complete re-writes of the Project module and for the community to start feeling comfortable submitting patches to the most important module in Drupal.
We all agree that project module is a core piece of functionality for our community.
I have taken several runs at using it as a user, since the 4.4 days. Whether through neglect or it being fundamentally bad (chicken and egg...if it's bad, it doesn't get fixed), base functionality hasn't worked out of the box outside of Drupal.org. People that have been around that long have all felt the pain, and are skeptical about the current codebase. So...just wanted to clear the air about that.
I did setup the project module once for a friend to evaluate as a platform for collaboration for his development team (commerical product, Java, only a few developers, spread worldwide, different timezones). Of course this was on Drupal, with forums, ...etc. This was in 4.4 IIRC. His comments were that it was lacking features that he needs in a non-Open Source volunteer environment. The first thing that caught his attention was the inability to assign tasks to other people, but only to himself. Of course there were other considerations that made him decide not to use Drupal (e.g. documentation was in Word format and wanted to continue to use that format). I am thinking of setting up project.module to track certain things I do whether it is development tasks or bugs, but I think more features are needed to make it useable outside of Drupal's environment.
On 27 Jan 2006, at 1:53 AM, Khalid B wrote:
I am thinking of setting up project.module to track certain things I do whether it is development tasks or bugs, but I think more features are needed to make it useable outside of Drupal's environment.
Actually. Project module needs less features. It's a cathedral, ie: a whole bunch of functionality hard coded to work in a certain way. It needs to be broken up into multiple modules, each with their own concern, that can be tied together to accomplish whatever project management needs you have. ie: it needs to become Lego. Smaller chunks will also be easier to maintain. It also re-implements both taxonomy and comments, which is my biggest beef with it. -- Adrian Rossouw Drupal developer and Bryght Guy http://drupal.org | http://bryght.com
Op vrijdag 27 januari 2006 05:54, schreef Adrian Rossouw:
It's a cathedral, ie: a whole bunch of functionality hard coded to work in a certain way.
It needs to be broken up into multiple modules, each with their own concern, that can be tied together to accomplish whatever project management needs you have.
ie: it needs to become Lego.
Right! This is exactly the reason that I went for PHPprojekt (talking about ugly code...) twice before :(. Project.module makes a lot of assumptions. E.G. you can configure the location of CVS, but you cannot *not* use CVS. This is whatpeople mean when they do not deploy it outside of typical software development environments. If i want to manage the organisation of a festival, there is no way I need CVS :) The Lego way: views.module, flexinode and workflow/actions bound together make a perfect project management system! I have no time to write howtos and all that, but I can tell that IMO that makes a very very good start for a project management suite, the proofs of concept look promising. Bèr -- [ Bèr Kessels | Drupal services www.webschuur.com ]
Actually. Project module needs less features.
Project module pioneered several features - mail, file attachments, etc. - that only much later appeared as stable features in other modules or APIs. Now, yes, it would be great if we had volunteers to refactor the module to use the features and APIs that now exist. This goes for comments too. But more immediately, we're working hard to complete 4.7 updates and improvements. Until this is done, we can't update drupal.org to HEAD. Help is needed on the final details! 1. There's a lingering detail from the Forms API update, http://drupal.org/node/45483. Checkboxes that stay checked. Anyone able to see why? 2. We're getting issues showing up for the wrong projects, http://drupal.org/node/38704. Anyone able to figure this out? 3. Pager links aren't appearing as part of the new project browsing interface, see issu at http://drupal.org/node/46778. Takers?
On 1/26/06, Boris Mann <boris@bryght.com> wrote:
The very fact that project runs only with HEAD is part of this issue. Again, AFAIK, current 4.6 download is broken by default. We should remove old releases unless they are going to be fixed...
I am running project modules just fine on a 4.6.5 site. It has usability problems as we all know, but it definitely works.
So for now...put down your project.module pitchforks, and file/review patches.
Well, sure, most all agree to that! Greg
participants (11)
-
Adrian Rossouw -
ae2005 -
Boris Mann -
Bèr Kessels -
Dries Buytaert -
Greg Knaddison -
Khalid B -
Kieran Lal -
Mark Fredrickson -
Nedjo Rogers -
Will Wyatt