Translation (pseudo)contexts in Drupal 7
Hello, As a language with poor morphology, English sometimes does not distinguish verbs from nouns. Filter, Upload, Archive, Link, Update, Post... and many other words that are used in Drupal. Other languages are a more morphology-heavy and when we translate Drupal to other languages this ambiguity may be a problem. Take Upload, for instance. There is a button "Upload", but there is also a module "Upload". There's the need to use different words. It's not an exclusivity for noun/verbs, though. "Order" is one thing in Views, and another thing in Ubercart. The shorter the string, the easier it is to exist this kind of ambiguity. There is already the use in Drupal core of string context. The blank variable in "!long-month-name May" is used distinguish "May" in the series "January, February.." to "May" in the series "Jan, Feb...". This very pattern could be used elsewhere: "!noun Filter" would be different from "!verb Filter", so that we could translate "Filtro" and "Filtrar", respectively, or "Filter" and "filtern". What do you think? Is this a good approach or something more radical should be done to support contexts? Perhaps a fourth symbol - #context, instead of "!, @, %" , to make it mor organized? There is still time to fix Drupal 7. See you, José San Martin Brazilian translator
great idea, This will not need a patch, just for fashion :P. So what we need is to agree in some reserved words for translation: Example 1: $string = 'Filtrar' = t('!verb Filter', array('!verb' => '')); Example 2: $string = 'Filtro' = t('!noun Filter', array('!noun' => '')); Blessings! On Sat, Jul 25, 2009 at 10:18 PM, José San Martin <jz.sanmartin@gmail.com>wrote:
Hello,
As a language with poor morphology, English sometimes does not distinguish verbs from nouns. Filter, Upload, Archive, Link, Update, Post... and many other words that are used in Drupal. Other languages are a more morphology-heavy and when we translate Drupal to other languages this ambiguity may be a problem. Take Upload, for instance. There is a button "Upload", but there is also a module "Upload". There's the need to use different words.
It's not an exclusivity for noun/verbs, though. "Order" is one thing in Views, and another thing in Ubercart. The shorter the string, the easier it is to exist this kind of ambiguity.
There is already the use in Drupal core of string context. The blank variable in "!long-month-name May" is used distinguish "May" in the series "January, February.." to "May" in the series "Jan, Feb...". This very pattern could be used elsewhere: "!noun Filter" would be different from "!verb Filter", so that we could translate "Filtro" and "Filtrar", respectively, or "Filter" and "filtern".
What do you think? Is this a good approach or something more radical should be done to support contexts? Perhaps a fourth symbol - #context, instead of "!, @, %" , to make it mor organized? There is still time to fix Drupal 7.
See you,
José San Martin Brazilian translator _______________________________________________ translations mailing list translations@drupal.org http://lists.drupal.org/mailman/listinfo/translations
-- Fernando P. García, http://www.develcuy.com Developer - Analista de Sistemas +51 1 9 8991 7871, Calle Santa Catalina Ancha #377, Cusco -Perú ** Antes de imprimir este mensaje piensa en tu compromiso con el medio ambiente, protegerlo depende de tí.
BUG :), I forgot the space at the very begin of the string. This is the right one: Example 1: $string = 'Filtrar' = ltrim(t('!verb Filter', array('!verb' => ''))); Example 2: $string = 'Filtro' = ltrim(t('!noun Filter', array('!noun' => ''))); Blessings! 2009/7/25 Fernando P. García <fernando@develcuy.com>
great idea,
This will not need a patch, just for fashion :P.
So what we need is to agree in some reserved words for translation:
Example 1:
$string = 'Filtrar' = t('!verb Filter', array('!verb' => ''));
Example 2:
$string = 'Filtro' = t('!noun Filter', array('!noun' => ''));
Blessings!
On Sat, Jul 25, 2009 at 10:18 PM, José San Martin <jz.sanmartin@gmail.com>wrote:
Hello,
As a language with poor morphology, English sometimes does not distinguish verbs from nouns. Filter, Upload, Archive, Link, Update, Post... and many other words that are used in Drupal. Other languages are a more morphology-heavy and when we translate Drupal to other languages this ambiguity may be a problem. Take Upload, for instance. There is a button "Upload", but there is also a module "Upload". There's the need to use different words.
It's not an exclusivity for noun/verbs, though. "Order" is one thing in Views, and another thing in Ubercart. The shorter the string, the easier it is to exist this kind of ambiguity.
There is already the use in Drupal core of string context. The blank variable in "!long-month-name May" is used distinguish "May" in the series "January, February.." to "May" in the series "Jan, Feb...". This very pattern could be used elsewhere: "!noun Filter" would be different from "!verb Filter", so that we could translate "Filtro" and "Filtrar", respectively, or "Filter" and "filtern".
What do you think? Is this a good approach or something more radical should be done to support contexts? Perhaps a fourth symbol - #context, instead of "!, @, %" , to make it mor organized? There is still time to fix Drupal 7.
See you,
José San Martin Brazilian translator _______________________________________________ translations mailing list translations@drupal.org http://lists.drupal.org/mailman/listinfo/translations
-- Fernando P. García, http://www.develcuy.com Developer - Analista de Sistemas +51 1 9 8991 7871, Calle Santa Catalina Ancha #377, Cusco -Perú
** Antes de imprimir este mensaje piensa en tu compromiso con el medio ambiente, protegerlo depende de tí.
-- Fernando P. García, http://www.develcuy.com Developer - Analista de Sistemas +51 1 9 8991 7871, Calle Santa Catalina Ancha #377, Cusco -Perú ** Antes de imprimir este mensaje piensa en tu compromiso con el medio ambiente, protegerlo depende de tí.
Warning 1, sorry for the SPAM What I suggested works only with very atomic expressions, because larger strings are large enough to prevent ambiguity. Blessings! 2009/7/25 Fernando P. García <fernando@develcuy.com>
BUG :), I forgot the space at the very begin of the string.
This is the right one:
Example 1:
$string = 'Filtrar' = ltrim(t('!verb Filter', array('!verb' => '')));
Example 2:
$string = 'Filtro' = ltrim(t('!noun Filter', array('!noun' => '')));
Blessings!
2009/7/25 Fernando P. García <fernando@develcuy.com>
great idea,
This will not need a patch, just for fashion :P.
So what we need is to agree in some reserved words for translation:
Example 1:
$string = 'Filtrar' = t('!verb Filter', array('!verb' => ''));
Example 2:
$string = 'Filtro' = t('!noun Filter', array('!noun' => ''));
Blessings!
On Sat, Jul 25, 2009 at 10:18 PM, José San Martin <jz.sanmartin@gmail.com
wrote:
Hello,
As a language with poor morphology, English sometimes does not distinguish verbs from nouns. Filter, Upload, Archive, Link, Update, Post... and many other words that are used in Drupal. Other languages are a more morphology-heavy and when we translate Drupal to other languages this ambiguity may be a problem. Take Upload, for instance. There is a button "Upload", but there is also a module "Upload". There's the need to use different words.
It's not an exclusivity for noun/verbs, though. "Order" is one thing in Views, and another thing in Ubercart. The shorter the string, the easier it is to exist this kind of ambiguity.
There is already the use in Drupal core of string context. The blank variable in "!long-month-name May" is used distinguish "May" in the series "January, February.." to "May" in the series "Jan, Feb...". This very pattern could be used elsewhere: "!noun Filter" would be different from "!verb Filter", so that we could translate "Filtro" and "Filtrar", respectively, or "Filter" and "filtern".
What do you think? Is this a good approach or something more radical should be done to support contexts? Perhaps a fourth symbol - #context, instead of "!, @, %" , to make it mor organized? There is still time to fix Drupal 7.
See you,
José San Martin Brazilian translator _______________________________________________ translations mailing list translations@drupal.org http://lists.drupal.org/mailman/listinfo/translations
-- Fernando P. García, http://www.develcuy.com Developer - Analista de Sistemas +51 1 9 8991 7871, Calle Santa Catalina Ancha #377, Cusco -Perú
** Antes de imprimir este mensaje piensa en tu compromiso con el medio ambiente, protegerlo depende de tí.
-- Fernando P. García, http://www.develcuy.com Developer - Analista de Sistemas +51 1 9 8991 7871, Calle Santa Catalina Ancha #377, Cusco -Perú
** Antes de imprimir este mensaje piensa en tu compromiso con el medio ambiente, protegerlo depende de tí.
-- Fernando P. García, http://www.develcuy.com Developer - Analista de Sistemas +51 1 9 8991 7871, Calle Santa Catalina Ancha #377, Cusco -Perú ** Antes de imprimir este mensaje piensa en tu compromiso con el medio ambiente, protegerlo depende de tí.
Jose, Good news! Drupal 7 already supports contexts natively on t() and format_plural() in a way standard to other applications using Gettext, and not via special hacks. See the issue on msgctxt support. Other areas like menu titles and JS strings still lack contexts unfortunately. BTW the latest releases of potx and l10n_server also have this context support now built in (when you translate Drupal 7 stuff). Gabor On 7/26/09, José San Martin <jz.sanmartin@gmail.com> wrote:
Hello,
As a language with poor morphology, English sometimes does not distinguish verbs from nouns. Filter, Upload, Archive, Link, Update, Post... and many other words that are used in Drupal. Other languages are a more morphology-heavy and when we translate Drupal to other languages this ambiguity may be a problem. Take Upload, for instance. There is a button "Upload", but there is also a module "Upload". There's the need to use different words.
It's not an exclusivity for noun/verbs, though. "Order" is one thing in Views, and another thing in Ubercart. The shorter the string, the easier it is to exist this kind of ambiguity.
There is already the use in Drupal core of string context. The blank variable in "!long-month-name May" is used distinguish "May" in the series "January, February.." to "May" in the series "Jan, Feb...". This very pattern could be used elsewhere: "!noun Filter" would be different from "!verb Filter", so that we could translate "Filtro" and "Filtrar", respectively, or "Filter" and "filtern".
What do you think? Is this a good approach or something more radical should be done to support contexts? Perhaps a fourth symbol - #context, instead of "!, @, %" , to make it mor organized? There is still time to fix Drupal 7.
See you,
José San Martin Brazilian translator _______________________________________________ translations mailing list translations@drupal.org http://lists.drupal.org/mailman/listinfo/translations
Thanks Gábor! On Sun, Jul 26, 2009 at 2:30 AM, Gábor Hojtsy<gabor@hojtsy.hu> wrote:
Jose,
Good news! Drupal 7 already supports contexts natively on t() and format_plural() in a way standard to other applications using Gettext, and not via special hacks. See the issue on msgctxt support. Other areas like menu titles and JS strings still lack contexts unfortunately.
BTW the latest releases of potx and l10n_server also have this context support now built in (when you translate Drupal 7 stuff).
Gabor
On 7/26/09, José San Martin <jz.sanmartin@gmail.com> wrote:
Hello,
As a language with poor morphology, English sometimes does not distinguish verbs from nouns. Filter, Upload, Archive, Link, Update, Post... and many other words that are used in Drupal. Other languages are a more morphology-heavy and when we translate Drupal to other languages this ambiguity may be a problem. Take Upload, for instance. There is a button "Upload", but there is also a module "Upload". There's the need to use different words.
It's not an exclusivity for noun/verbs, though. "Order" is one thing in Views, and another thing in Ubercart. The shorter the string, the easier it is to exist this kind of ambiguity.
There is already the use in Drupal core of string context. The blank variable in "!long-month-name May" is used distinguish "May" in the series "January, February.." to "May" in the series "Jan, Feb...". This very pattern could be used elsewhere: "!noun Filter" would be different from "!verb Filter", so that we could translate "Filtro" and "Filtrar", respectively, or "Filter" and "filtern".
What do you think? Is this a good approach or something more radical should be done to support contexts? Perhaps a fourth symbol - #context, instead of "!, @, %" , to make it mor organized? There is still time to fix Drupal 7.
See you,
José San Martin Brazilian translator _______________________________________________ translations mailing list translations@drupal.org http://lists.drupal.org/mailman/listinfo/translations
_______________________________________________ translations mailing list translations@drupal.org http://lists.drupal.org/mailman/listinfo/translations
BTW the issue link is http://drupal.org/node/334283 Gábor On Sun, Jul 26, 2009 at 4:38 PM, José San Martin<jz.sanmartin@gmail.com> wrote:
Thanks Gábor!
On Sun, Jul 26, 2009 at 2:30 AM, Gábor Hojtsy<gabor@hojtsy.hu> wrote:
Jose,
Good news! Drupal 7 already supports contexts natively on t() and format_plural() in a way standard to other applications using Gettext, and not via special hacks. See the issue on msgctxt support. Other areas like menu titles and JS strings still lack contexts unfortunately.
BTW the latest releases of potx and l10n_server also have this context support now built in (when you translate Drupal 7 stuff).
Gabor
On 7/26/09, José San Martin <jz.sanmartin@gmail.com> wrote:
Hello,
As a language with poor morphology, English sometimes does not distinguish verbs from nouns. Filter, Upload, Archive, Link, Update, Post... and many other words that are used in Drupal. Other languages are a more morphology-heavy and when we translate Drupal to other languages this ambiguity may be a problem. Take Upload, for instance. There is a button "Upload", but there is also a module "Upload". There's the need to use different words.
It's not an exclusivity for noun/verbs, though. "Order" is one thing in Views, and another thing in Ubercart. The shorter the string, the easier it is to exist this kind of ambiguity.
There is already the use in Drupal core of string context. The blank variable in "!long-month-name May" is used distinguish "May" in the series "January, February.." to "May" in the series "Jan, Feb...". This very pattern could be used elsewhere: "!noun Filter" would be different from "!verb Filter", so that we could translate "Filtro" and "Filtrar", respectively, or "Filter" and "filtern".
What do you think? Is this a good approach or something more radical should be done to support contexts? Perhaps a fourth symbol - #context, instead of "!, @, %" , to make it mor organized? There is still time to fix Drupal 7.
See you,
José San Martin Brazilian translator _______________________________________________ translations mailing list translations@drupal.org http://lists.drupal.org/mailman/listinfo/translations
_______________________________________________ translations mailing list translations@drupal.org http://lists.drupal.org/mailman/listinfo/translations
_______________________________________________ translations mailing list translations@drupal.org http://lists.drupal.org/mailman/listinfo/translations
This is really good news as this issue applies to Estonian translation as well. - Katrin On Jul 25, 2009, at 10:30 PM, Gábor Hojtsy wrote:
Jose,
Good news! Drupal 7 already supports contexts natively on t() and format_plural() in a way standard to other applications using Gettext, and not via special hacks. See the issue on msgctxt support. Other areas like menu titles and JS strings still lack contexts unfortunately.
BTW the latest releases of potx and l10n_server also have this context support now built in (when you translate Drupal 7 stuff).
Gabor
On 7/26/09, José San Martin <jz.sanmartin@gmail.com> wrote:
Hello,
As a language with poor morphology, English sometimes does not distinguish verbs from nouns. Filter, Upload, Archive, Link, Update, Post... and many other words that are used in Drupal. Other languages are a more morphology-heavy and when we translate Drupal to other languages this ambiguity may be a problem. Take Upload, for instance. There is a button "Upload", but there is also a module "Upload". There's the need to use different words.
It's not an exclusivity for noun/verbs, though. "Order" is one thing in Views, and another thing in Ubercart. The shorter the string, the easier it is to exist this kind of ambiguity.
There is already the use in Drupal core of string context. The blank variable in "!long-month-name May" is used distinguish "May" in the series "January, February.." to "May" in the series "Jan, Feb...". This very pattern could be used elsewhere: "!noun Filter" would be different from "!verb Filter", so that we could translate "Filtro" and "Filtrar", respectively, or "Filter" and "filtern".
What do you think? Is this a good approach or something more radical should be done to support contexts? Perhaps a fourth symbol - #context, instead of "!, @, %" , to make it mor organized? There is still time to fix Drupal 7.
See you,
José San Martin Brazilian translator _______________________________________________ translations mailing list translations@drupal.org http://lists.drupal.org/mailman/listinfo/translations
_______________________________________________ translations mailing list translations@drupal.org http://lists.drupal.org/mailman/listinfo/translations
participants (4)
-
Fernando P. García -
Gábor Hojtsy -
José San Martin -
Katrin Silvius