[consulting] Setting Up as an Independent Contractor

Sami Khan sami at etopian.net
Mon Mar 29 03:06:42 UTC 2010 

I am sorry but when you work on Drupal, you should retain the rights to
your code or it should be GPL, I hate the idea of businesses
appropriating not only labour but intellectual property as well. Just
because this is the norm does not mean its right or fair.

In any case obviously businesses are built on trust, but there are
always cases where trust falls through or a situation occurs which is
out of the control of both sides and the business decides that the
contractor should pay for the work or that it should be free. They then
make up lies and stories in order to keep from paying for the project,
speaking from experience here. As such contracts are contingencies when
trust does not work any more. They are absolutely necessary because
otherwise you are prey to all the weirdos out there. 

Let's also notice that contractors usually don't have the profits
businesses do to cover loss, they are more or less working for a
salary... and therefore, should protect themselves to the greatest
extent provided by law.


Regards,
Sami

On Mon, 2010-03-29 at 02:58 +0000, Eric Tucker wrote:
> Hi guys,
> 
> Just a few thoughts. I'm on both sides of the coin as both a consultant and one who does purchase services from subcontractors as well as for my own projects. 
> 
> Typically, my clients will want ownership or unfettered licenses to the code. Investors tend to prefer that the company they are investing in owns the code, and as I do not wish to be a hindrance to my clients that means code gets assigned to them. However if the client is okay with it, for reusable code I put in a license to be able to reuse the code for other purposes. 
> 
> There are many forms of licensing and types of licensing. 
> 
> You can make code assignable upon delivery or payment. 
> 
> In general, I try to run as close to a zero balance project as I can. The client pays a certain amount up front or as a deposit, and then the remainder is paid upon delivery or as we go along in regular intervals. If being paid prior to delivery or specific milestones, I insist on seeing intermediate progress from my contractors. Furthermore, I try my best to show the end client all progress. I'm all about openness in this regard. I give it, and I expect it. 
> 
> I cannot ask for a good amount up front without having built up some trust. Trust is a two way street, and both should give the other some trust and work to build the level of trust incrementally where possible. 
> 
> I shy away from one off deals or those without an ongoing future relationship, so my advice may not be pertinent to all. 
> 
> If there is an established relationship, then I may get less up front or do work on a 30 to 45 days basis.  This is not without some risk, but I've only been burned once. 
> 
> When I purchase services, I look for the same terms I would expect to be held to.
> 
> Remember this:  being a contractor is running a business. Business is best built on relationships. Relationships are best built on trust. Trust must be two ways and be built up over time.  Others will not trust if some trust is not given. I try to build relationships with those I can trust and who can learn to trust me. It takes time. 
> Sent wirelessly via BlackBerry from T-Mobile.
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Sami Khan <sami at etopian.net>
> Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 19:50:43 
> To: Dave Hall<me at davehall.com.au>
> Cc: <consulting at drupal.org>
> Subject: Re: [consulting] Setting Up as an Independent Contractor
> 
> Dave,
> 
> I agree. 
> 
> However, better to have a contract with at some of the aforementioned
> things than no contract at all. Anyone can go and get an actual lawyer,
> but some people will not... So better they have some advice from people
> with experience, rather than no advice.
> 
> That being said, do by all means invest in a lawyer, a book keeper, an
> accountant, and so on... It does serve its purposes when you are in a
> heated situation... Lots of ass holes are out there to get you if you
> are not diligent.
> 
> Sami
> 
> On Mon, 2010-03-29 at 12:34 +1100, Dave Hall wrote:
> > Hi,
> > 
> > >From experience, have a contract drafted by a lawyer can save you a lot
> > of hassle.  It should contain things like, who retains ownership of the
> > work (should be you), what happens when they don't pay (penalty
> > interest), what is the legal jurisdiction for disputers (where you live)
> > and what expenses the client is expected to cover (long distance, travel
> > accommodation, meals etc).  
> > 
> > On several occasions I have bashed clients over the head with my
> > contract.  Having a relationship with a solicitor also makes it easy for
> > getting letters of demand issued by the lawyer too.  
> > 
> > My contracts have 2 parts the generic contract and the project specific
> > schedule which contains information about the project, rates etc.  The
> > schedule is referred to by the contract, so I can recycle the same
> > contract for all of my clients.
> > 
> > If the client wants variations to my standard contract they can pay my
> > legal bills so I get the advice I need before drafting/signing it.
> > 
> > When it comes to company structure, tax and book keeping advice, invest
> > in a good accountant.  The money you pay them is a usually a deductible
> > expense, and can help you structure your affairs in such a way that you
> > you end up in front even after pay for their services.
> > 
> > Cheers
> > 
> > Dave
> > 
> > On Sun, 2010-03-28 at 09:10 -0600, Sami Khan wrote:
> > > It doesn't have to be that complicated, but it can be if you run into
> > > the wrong sort of person and/or situation. Just make sure you have
> > > plenty of disclaimers in there and clauses that keep them from suing you
> > > for any reason whatsoever, you can opt for a mediator if there needs to
> > > be a way to resolve disputes. That's the biggest thing. Further, have
> > > all terms of work clearly laid out, and the fact that they will be
> > > billed for any additional work on an hourly basis. I am also not a
> > > lawyer either.
> > > 
> > > Regards,
> > > Sami
> > > 
> > > On Sun, 2010-03-28 at 09:00 -0600, Steve Kessler wrote:
> > > > Becoming an independent contractor has lots of legal implications on
> > > > both the state and federal level in the United States if that is where
> > > > you are. It is probably best that you consult your jurisdiction about
> > > > what they require. Colorado for example does business registrations
> > > > through the Secretary of State office. An attorney and tax accountant
> > > > are good resources in this process. I know this is not an answer with
> > > > real answers but hopefully this will give you an idea where to
> > > > look….oh ya and my attorney requires me to say that I am not an
> > > > attorney and this is not legal advice.  
> > > > 
> > > >  
> > > > 
> > > > -Steve   
> > > > 
> > > >  
> > > > 
> > > > Steve Kessler 
> > > > 
> > > > Denver DataMan 
> > > > 
> > > > 303-587-4428 
> > > > 
> > > > Sign up for the Denver DataMan Free eNewslettter
> > > > 
> > > >  
> > > > 
> > > >  
> > > > 
> > > > From: George Lee [mailto:georgeleejr617 at gmail.com] 
> > > > Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2010 8:22 AM
> > > > To: consulting at drupal.org
> > > > Subject: [consulting] Setting Up as an Independent Contractor
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > >  
> > > > 
> > > > Hello,
> > > > 
> > > > Also do folks have information on what steps to take to be an
> > > > independent contractor? Want to make sure I'm follow the right
> > > > procedures.
> > > > 
> > > > Peace, community, justice,
> > > > - George
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > consulting mailing list
> > > > consulting at drupal.org
> > > > http://lists.drupal.org/mailman/listinfo/consulting
> > > 
> > > 
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> > 
> > 
> 
> 
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