[development] #drupal and #drupal-contribute split (Was: Re: Proposal: Move all dev support off this list to new StackExchange site)

Gábor Hojtsy gabor at hojtsy.hu
Sat Mar 19 08:13:33 UTC 2011

On Fri, Mar 18, 2011 at 8:49 PM, Angela Byron <drupal-devel at webchick.net> wrote:
> We've repeated this "retreat into our shell" pattern over and over again.
> IRC (#drupal -> #drupal-contribute), mailing lists (development ->
> groups/issue queues), the forums (issue queues). What we're left with now is
> an entire "generation" of Drupal users who think Drupal.org is a place to
> *consume*, not a place to *participate*.
> In the end, I have absolutely no idea where Drupal 9 core/contrib developers
> are going to come from. And that is absolutely terrifying.
> And, fwiw, I "called" this inevitable outcome back in 2009 when this shift
> was proposed: http://drupal.org/node/634486#comment-2272630 Bleh. :(

Angie, did this happen to Drupal 7? (Given many of the IRC, forum vs
issue queue, etc. migration happened considerable time ago) I've seen
lots of new faces contributing to Drupal 7, and it seemed to follow
the natural way of progression as Drupal 5 and Drupal 6 went. Some
people keep being in the top list and totally new faces come in,
who've not even contributed to the previous version, or barely did so.
If these "siloifications" did not have a clear effect so far, how do
you expect them to kick in for Drupal 9?

I think there are all kinds of levels of access now. There are people
who come and participate (contribute) at Drupalcons, then the
Drupalcamps, then the meetups, then the issue queues, then forums,
then the lurkers who just consume information. The community grew big
and there are just too many avenues to contribute and participate.

For a really small village school, all children are taught in one
class room together, even their ages are spanning multiple years, and
there is one teacher. As the village grows, the classes grow and it
becomes impossible to fit all kids in one room and for one teacher to
guide them. Then come multiple classes, one for each year, and subject
expert teachers. Once the classes grew big again, then comes multiple
classes even for the same year, and teachers become so numerous that
you need to manage them too.

For kids, which classes they take and who gonna be their teacher is
not a matter of choice, its well defined. In Drupal's case, "our kids"
maybe even don't know where they need to learn or where they need help
vs. where can they be teachers and guiders. I think we merely need
better ways to help people get to the right place, not to unify all
places and get everyone in a biiiig hallway, where it becomes a mess
and impossible to guide people to the right place.

Just imagine every event of a Drupalcon happening in the keynote room.
Since, ... you know ..., everybody can fit there, the keynotes proved
it. Does that make it easier to help people find each other and make


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