For who do you develop Drupal, or Drupal stuff, or Drupal sites? In the end that is for yourself. And not for Zend, not to promote the latest PHP version, often not even for The Good Of The Web. Just for your own itches to be scratched. As long as there are people who have itches on a PHP4 platform that is what we will have to support. If the choice is between supporting the latest Drupal or rebuilding your server architecture to support a newer version of PHP, I am certain the mayority will choose to simply drop Drupal support. Then the argument about being leader and/or follower was brought up. While it is nice to work on a Better Internet, or whatever high goals, in the end it is your itch that needs to be scratched. When it comes to being leaders, Rasmus should talk to SuSe, RedHat, or Ubuntu, not to Drupal. The distributors should be the ones leading us into a php5 era. If they don't do that, /then/ you corner yourself. I think it is really strange that people actually think about no longer supporting something that is -in fact- the biggest part of their success: the fact that PHP and MySQL is available on nearly every host. If you move away from that, you are going to kill yourself, your business, your websites and the Drupal community. Within a few months, the bulk of the developers will have moved on to a CMS that they can actually install, using the tools and systems they have available or can afford. Bèr