[development] Drupal Answers: A Stackoverflow/StackExchange site proposal

Tue Feb 1 15:50:47 UTC 2011

On Tue, Feb 1, 2011 at 11:52 AM, David Metzler <metzler.dl at gmail.com> wrote:

> Likewise although I already have to some extent:
>
>
first non-sequitur:

> I think we have a pretty free / wiki like approach in place already.  I
> also think that this is something that's best decided by those who are doing
> the work.
>

wot? So if it's a free / wiki  like approach, leave it alone, there are no
decisions to make. Maybe some occasional pruning or abuse control, but that
should be it.

and then again:

Seems like those that are up for doing the work should have the loudest
> voice here.
>

This is the whole problem to the approach up till now: the documentation
should not be organized top-down: this model has shown itself to be a
failure. Everyone should be contributing to the Drupal Handbook
documentation, and to the extent they do, they are having the loudest voice.
There's no need for a "team" to exist on top of that.

All they do is move stuff around so it's harder to find. Or take valuable
Drupal 6 stuff out.

Victor

> Dave
>
> On Feb 1, 2011, at 4:37 AM, Victor Kane wrote:
>
> I won't be able to go to DrupalCon this year, so I'll give my feedback
> here.
>
> One thing that's clear from the success of many open documentation sites
> (wikipedia, stack overflow) is that they avoid top down governance, they let
> the meritocracy form on the basis of what actually happens.
>
> I firmly believe that the existence of "document leads" and other forms of
> control have done more harm than good, despite heroic efforts from these
> individuals, since all that has happened over the last few years is a
> constant moving around of a hierarchical structure.
>
> Why wouldn't a freer, wiki like approach work?
>
> Victor Kane
> http://awebfactory.com.ar
>
> On Mon, Jan 31, 2011 at 8:37 PM, Randy Fay <randy at randyfay.com> wrote:
>
>> I don't think we can delegate any part of Drupal to something we don't
>> control; I think that's just a non-starter.
>>
>> So for me, the issue is what we can learn from StackOverflow and friends -
>> they do great stuff and end up with great content. And yes, I think we
>> should build something on that.
>>
>> Who is signing up to build it? I think it's an easy sell.
>>
>> -Randy
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Jan 31, 2011 at 4:25 PM, Dan Horning <dan.horning at planetnoc.com>wrote:
>>
>>> i have to ask ... what would we actually gain by doing this - cleanup the
>>> various methods for finding info about a given module or theme or bug a
>>> little and we far surpass this suggested tool
>>>
>>> it seems that stackoverflow is driven very highly on userpoints to
>>> control access - which while a good thing - doesn't really fit the
>>> development model we have here. there are existing processes that would have
>>> to change to fit the suggested model. I for one am more for peer reviews and
>>> leadership staff assigning access than a points system that someone could
>>> rack up points and just get access ... what's that really do for the
>>> community - seems that would be great if we were just a tech help forum -
>>> awarding points for the users that help and giving them more access - but
>>> what's that do for drupal and it's community? (i know there is a potential
>>> for this to help ...)
>>>
>>> another area of issue to me is - another login ? or would it use SSO?
>>> do the drupal leadership users and dries have admin level control...?
>>>
>>> mostly here i just don't get what adding yet another resource (like has
>>> been said before) would do to help the lead devs, module + theme devs and
>>> just supporting drupal. if i had say -=- i'd vote against this idea
>>>
>>> --
>>> Dan Horning
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> > From: "Victor Kane" <victorkane at gmail.com>
>>> > To: development at drupal.org
>>> > Sent: Monday, January 31, 2011 6:01:55 PM
>>> > Subject: Re: [development] Drupal Answers: A
>>> Stackoverflow/StackExchange site proposal
>>> > I guess this is a good place to start:
>>> > http://area51.stackexchange.com/faq
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > On Mon, Jan 31, 2011 at 8:00 PM, Victor Kane < victorkane at gmail.com >
>>> > wrote:
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > On Mon, Jan 31, 2011 at 6:57 PM, Josh Koenig < josh at getpantheon.com >
>>> > wrote:
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > Stew,
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > Thanks for starting this thread. This is important stuff:
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > http://area51.stackexchange.com/proposals/2978/drupal-answers
>>> >
>>> > I want to put my support behind this proposal and explain my thinking
>>> > in doing so.
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > The Drupal community is already growing faster than Drupal's
>>> > infrastructure can easily support. With the release of D7 and all the
>>> > other associated projects getting off the ground, drupal.org is
>>> > increasingly often a bottleneck or blocker. We have wonderful hosts
>>> > from OSUOSL, but the human resources needed to develop, maintain and
>>> > manage our own infrastructure (which is a 24x7x365 job) are limited.
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > We have to pick our battles. I much would rather see energy, effort,
>>> > attention and money poured into continuing to improve our git and
>>> > module infrastructure — which is much more deeply intrinsic to the
>>> > health and future of the project — and accept that even though we
>>> > *can* build our own StackOverflow (@eaton proved this already) that
>>> > doesn't necessarily mean it's the best use of limited resources, or
>>> > the best thing for the project.
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > Drupal can theoretically/technically solve a lot of its own problems,
>>> > but I think we often suffer from a "not built here" prejudice as a
>>> > result. In the realm of getting good quality answers to Drupal
>>> > questions out to the most people possible, I can't see how a
>>> > StackExchange site would do anything but help. I would love to see the
>>> > community embrace something really cool and useful from the wider
>>> > Internet as a way to promote the project.
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > You make a convincing argument Josh; my own gut feeling has been,
>>> > reading this thread, "how can we delegate something so important to
>>> > the Drupal Community as its own documentation to another party who may
>>> > or may not exist in the near/medium/long term".
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > Can someone inform somewhat on who these guys are? And why there and
>>> > not someplace else?
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > Victor
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > Finally, I should say that I *do not* think a StackExchange answers
>>> > site replaces anything. It's not an issue queue, and it's not a
>>> > replacement for the dialogue that exist in the forums. I would say
>>> > it's a new resource, something that can help the 10s of 1000s of
>>> > people who will be trying to wrap their mind around Drupal in the
>>> > coming year.
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > Cheers
>>> > -josh
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Randy Fay
>> Drupal Module and Site Development
>> randy at randyfay.com
>> +1  970.462.7450
>>
>>
>
>
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