October 2006 - Development - lists.drupal.org

Themes - Trying to do too much in one theme?
by Michelle Cox 05 Oct '06

05 Oct '06

I've been reading these theming threads with much interest and it seems to me that part of the problem is trying to make the default theme work for different kinds of users. With respect to theming, I think we have three main types: 1) The out-of-the-boxer. This user just wants to set up a site and use the theme that's there. Maybe change the colours, but that's it. For this user, a very pretty eye-candy theme is great. Everything should be styled and it should just work with all browsers. 2) The power user that can't theme their way out of a wet paper bag. This user doesn't care a lot what the default theme looks like but wants one that's easy to modify with very little CSS/HTML/PHP knowledge. This theme needs very little markup and should focus heavily on changeability. 3) The theming guru. I don't know what this class wants. Maybe they don't even care what theme comes with Drupal as they always make their own? I think a big problem is that 1 and 2 are at odds with each other. Having a Wow! theme that's easy to change is difficult, maybe impossible. What I think, and this is totally IMO, is that the default theme (and maybe a couple others for variety) are made totally Wow! to address user type 1. Don't worry too much about making these easy to change. Make them work and make them pretty. Maybe put something for changing the colours at the top for a little tweak but, beyond that, expect them to be used as is. To address user type 2's needs, what we really need is a set of wire frames with minimal styling and lots of comments. Take the basic shapes that most websites used (that is, 1 2 or 3 columns, header, footer, stuff like that) and code them really well so the layout holds up to whatever contribs throw at it. Then put in all the various elements that can be styled, but leave them empty or with something fairly neutral. Put lots of comments on them so someone with just a little CSS knowledge can look at it and know what a change there will do. By doing this, the novice CSSer won't have to fight the browser quirk layout issues and all that mess but will be able to easily tweak the theme to look how they want it without having to unstyle a bunch of eye candy. Just my $0.02 US ;) Michelle (type 2)

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Re: [development] new CVS branch/tag conventions (was Re: tagadelic 'backport' for 4.7)
by Chad Phillips -- Apartment Lines 05 Oct '06

05 Oct '06

On Oct 4, 2006, at 4:26 PM, Khalid B wrote: > >> 1) "DRUPAL-4-7--1" and "DRUPAL-4-7--1-0" >> >> 2) "DRUPAL-4-7-V-1" and "DRUPAL-4-7-V-1-0" >> >> 3) "DRUPAL-4-7-R-1" and "DRUPAL-4-7-R-1-0" >> >> 4) "DRUPAL-4-7-REV-1" and "DRUPAL-4-7-REV-1-0" >> >> 5) "DRUPAL-4-7_1" and "DRUPAL-4-7_1-0" (just for comparison, this >> isn't >> a contender) > > I think #4 is the least ambiguous. the -- is the most concise, but > I am afraid > it would not be obvious to new Drupal users, or non-technical users. i second this opinion -- it adds three more characters to the name, but makes it totally obvious to any developer--even those with no drupal experience. +1 to #4 :)

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Any way to get a poll? Drupal 5.0 Default theme.
by Trae McCombs 04 Oct '06

04 Oct '06

It would be nice if we could figure out which way we are currently wanting to go with things. While the theme @ http://themes.net/ isn't finished yet [Waiting to find out if Dries thinks we are on the right track], I would like to find out what people think about the current direction of the two themes: http://istyledthis.nl vs. http://themes.net/ I've posted a poll on themes.net, but I wonder if it would be good to have an "official" poll somewhere. This isn't meant to be a divisive thing, but more to see where people are. I'm sure Steef will post his comments on the state of his theme, so please allow for that feedback. [Steef, If you create an account on themes.net I can give you admin access if there is something you need to post] Currently, the Deliciously Zen theme is only set to work @ a fixed position, but of course the fluid one will be fixed along with other details. Farsheed and I (and others) will work to make sure it's something we can hopefully mostly all be proud of. :) Let the voting begin! -- Trae McCombs || http://occy.net/ Founder - Themes.org // Linux.com

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Re: [development] Any way to get a poll? Drupal 5.0 Default theme.
by Nathaniel Catchpole 04 Oct '06

04 Oct '06

Jeff Eaton said: >Ultimately, I think we would be better served by settling >on a much-improved base XHTML layout (zen's is MUCH better than any >previous Drupal default) and promote it as a base for pure-css themes by >designers who lacked the programming experince to put together a Drupal >theme from scratch. This is the main thing for me as a non-coder (although I understand CSS and html reasonably well). Bluemarine isn't pretty without any alterations, but I can be pretty certain that it will display output from contributed modules readably and is likely to be upgraded for the next release of Drupal. It doesn't contain any structural images (backgrounds, block corners etc.), so it's easy to swap css colours/spacing around without being concerned about changing those additional elements to see what it'll look like roughly. So with that knowledge, I can: *use it as a base to develop another theme from - i.e. change css and page.tpl.php a bit at a time instead of starting from scratch or spending hours looking through the themes index. *take code from page.tpl.php and styles.css and plug it into other themes if I'm having trouble reproducing, say, primary links displayed inline in the header. In both cases, if there's an upgrade, it's going to be relatively easy to apply any changes to Bluemarine again, or compare the old and new versions to upgrade my own modified version. With this in mind, for any user who's going to do more than just install it and leave it as it is, it makes sense to have a transparent structure clean and clear coding (ideally with code comments in there as well). Then medium-experience spare time admins like me can see what the various elements are making it work and begin to understand how they're related - this can then be applied to contrib. themes or building from scratch later. The javascript rounded corners and/or multiple divs sounded like moves in the opposite direction to that. If there's going to be a move towards more themes in a drupal installation, then it makes sense to have the more "boxed in"/complex ones as options - so someone who just wants to pick a theme and stick with it has easy access to some choices. Also, it does matter what the core theme looks like. The first time I used drupal was when I did a fantastico install alongside another CMS (iirc geeklog, and I'd tried postnuke before that). Drupal.org looks good - some other CMS sites are really ugly. I looked at things in fantastico before I'd ever seen the homepage of a CMS though, and I'd imagine that's the way a lot of people come across them - or at least start using them. You've also got opensourcecms.com where people will be flicking through various options at speed, and will be thinking about usability more than customisation when they know it's not 'their' site and any theme changes will be wiped in a matter of minutes. Regards, Nathaniel Catchpole (catch) -- Confidentiality: This email and its attachments are intended for the addressee only and may be confidential or the subject of legal privilege. If this email and its attachments have come to you in error you must take no action based on them, nor must you copy them, distribute them or show them to anyone. Please contact the sender to notify them of the error. Security: Security Warning: Please note that this e-mail has been created in the knowledge that e-mail is not a 100% secure communications medium. We advise that you understand and observe this lack of security when e-mailing us. Viruses: This email and any attached files have been scanned for the presence of computer viruses. However, you are advised that you open any attachments at your own risk. Please note that electronic mail may be monitored in accordance with the Telecommunications (Lawful Business Practices) (Interception of Communications) Regulations 2000. Disclaimer: Any views or opinions presented are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of B6 Sixth Form unless explicitly stated otherwise ----------------------------------------------------------------------- This message has been inspected by DynaComm i:mail -----------------------------------------------------------------------

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Re: [development] Any way to get a poll? Drupal 5.0 Default theme.
by Michelle Cox 04 Oct '06

04 Oct '06

On 10/3/2006 9:39:33 PM, Walt Daniels (wdlists(a)optonline.net) wrote: >The contrib themes are a good start but they need a uniform classification >scheme so one can tell at a glance the basic properties (fixed/fluid), >(css/tables/mixed), n-col, etc. >Perhaps the secret, at least for me, is themes which can be easily >specialized a bit to look unique by someone with a poor graphic eye for >beauty. This means getting all the little things right, like margins, >alignment and especially browser agnostic. This is where I am. I find theming the most difficult part of Drupal. Some day, I'd like to get paid for doing Drupal sites for small businesses in the area. My target market likely won't pay enough for a site for me to be able to subcontract out the theme part. So the easier Drupal can make it for a non graphic designer to come up with a decent looking theme, the better. I realize the truly outstanding themes will always take someone who really knows how to design, but non-designers should at least be able to come up with something usable by changing colours and graphics and not having to worry about all the browser quirks and whatnot. Michelle

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Writing updates for minor releases
by Karoly Negyesi 04 Oct '06

04 Oct '06

Hi, I closed http://drupal.org/node/64212 for good. To sum up, if you are writing a core patch which adds an update to a minor release, then you need to duplicate that in the HEAD section (which has a different numbering) and do it in such a way that the second update won't generate an error. To achieve this, use DROP IF EXSITS for indexes (both databases), in the unlikely case you are adding a field, check for its existence first through SELECT * FROM, db_fetch_array, isset. ALTERs need no special taking care of. I do not think there will be a very complex update in a minor revision ever but if there will be, we can solve that when the need arrives. Note that the above did not divulge into introspection which is available for complex cases. Regards NK

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Re: [development] Fwd: [website] declaratieformulier
by Bèr Kessels 04 Oct '06

04 Oct '06

Op woensdag 4 oktober 2006 10:02, schreef u: > Hoi Ber, > ik had Mick al een formulier gestuurd. komt er binnenkort een > declaratieformulier op de site? > groet > Femke Dat kan, dat is alleen nog niet met Onne besproken. Ten eerste moeten we nog even iets belangrijkere zaken afronden voor de site, maar het kan zeker op de todolijst erbij. En ten tweede moet ik dan weten /wat/ voor declaratieformulier, waar het heengaat, hoe het daarheen gaat etc. Over dat laatste, een voorbeeldje: Je kunt wel een webwinkel op je site zetten, maar een webwinkel betekent veel meer dan een paar pagina"s op je site: je moet de spullen die je verkoopt ook (in voorraad) hebben, je moet een logistiek plan hebben (hoe stuur ik het op), je moet het geld kunnen afhandelen, etc. Dit om aan te geven dat "een declaratieformulier online zetten" de moeite niet is, maar dat alles "eromheen" ook moet kloppen! Bèr -- [ End-user Drupal services and hosting | Sympal.nl ] Nieuwsartikelen, of weblog.: http://help.sympal.nl/nieuwsartikelen_of_weblog

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Re: [development] Any way to get a poll? Drupal 5.0 Default theme.
by Steven Peck 04 Oct '06

04 Oct '06

No. The originating theme base is here: http://www.oswd.org/design/preview/id/2634 It was mentioned in a much earlier post. -sp ________________________________ From: development-bounces(a)drupal.org [mailto:development-bounces@drupal.org] On Behalf Of Kieran Lal Sent: Tuesday, October 03, 2006 11:22 PM To: development(a)drupal.org Subject: Re: [development] Any way to get a poll? Drupal 5.0 Default theme. On Oct 3, 2006, at 10:16 AM, Trae McCombs wrote: While the theme @ http://themes.net/ <http://themes.net/> isn't finished yet [Waiting to find out if Dries thinks we are on the right track], I would like to find out what people think about the current direction of the two themes: Is this a copy of http://www.themespress.com/ ? Kieran

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How long a CVS update will be applied to project download
by Drupal Indonesia 04 Oct '06

04 Oct '06

I have submit my revision of Blogger module. I know that the drupal.orf/project will run on a cron task to take this new module revision. Can one tell me how long the drupal/project will be update? I need this info to make sure that my SmartCVS succesfully uploaded and received by drupal project. Regards.

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CCK type duplication issue needs review
by Sammy Spets 04 Oct '06

04 Oct '06

Hi all, A patch needs review! It fixes a long standing problem with CCK being unable to duplicate types properly. Please surf over to the issue and review the patch so we can see it committed: http://drupal.org/node/78444 I've also had troubles with CCK's views support in that it doesn't support the multiple instances of a duplicated type's columns. I can't file an issue (or patch) for that yet because the behaviour only exists after the patch above is committed! :) Cheers, -- Sammy Spets Synerger Pty Ltd http://synerger.com

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